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File:1983ddukmapnew.png
File:83britmap (3).png
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TBA banned knolage.

This is what Althist Wiki tries to deny in Doomsday 1983. TBA losses in pink, held in Brown. Arrow leads the way to Matlock, who a squad visited and defectors joined. Officially there is no map and there is not to be one since it apparently ruined the fun and some borders are vague anyhow. Author: Boldmouse2.

OverviewEdit

Doomsday 1983 was very dodgy in places due to a mixture of political bias and military ignorance. I found several heavy implausibilities.

Lore and cannon issues in the UKEdit

It is a real clusterfuck !

New London (1983: Doomsday)Edit

A 100Kt nuke would have leveled most of Windsor north of it on fire. Fall out would be Windows would have shattered in Gerrard's Cross, miles away. Even a 10kt nuke would shatter windows in Windsor and burn up Eton Wick. Is it possible for the place to survive and become a state or not, I think it is unlikely.

User:Todetode :. ~ Under the Hood, Connect to Basic information? ~ Todetode (talk). 11:30, July 4, 2020 (UTC)

True British Army (1983: Doomsday)Edit

It is now long cannon that Luton became a major TBA city that Essex later conquered. Lore says it was hit by a 100 kt nuke that would have destroyed it apart from the outer fringes of adjacent Dunstable, thus a plot hole and story line paradox. I propose that he nuke slightly misses (it happened for Glasgow and Liverpool). If the Luton nuke exploded 5 miles to the north over Barton-Le-Clay, most of Luton (except a small bit by the airport and it's 10kt nuke) would only get moderate or light blast damage, plus any radiation depending on the winds, thus the town and the few survivors could be recovered by the TBA.

User:Todetode :. ~ Under the Hood, Connect to Basic information? ~ Todetode (talk). 11:30, July 4, 2020 (UTC)

Dorset, Hertfordshire and OxfordshireEdit

Who owns the counties of Dorset, Hertfordshire and Oxfordshire?

  • Articles and maps disagree:
  1. OBN page- Oxen and Berks are Celtic.
  2. Celtic Alliance page- Hertfordshire, Oxfordshire, Berkshire are Celtic.
  3. Essex page- Hertfordshire is Essexian. New London's part of Berkshire is Celtic.
  4. Maps generally agree Hertfordshire is equally terra nullis or Essex, New London is Celtic, non New London Berkshire and Dorset shown equally terra nullis and Celtic, and Oxen mostly as terra nullis.

Hertfordshire in next door to Essex, so they would have the best chance of getting to it, but would any one want Oxfordshire yet.

User:Todetode :. ~ Under the Hood, Connect to Basic information? ~ Todetode (talk). 21:03, July 4, 2020 (UTC)

Lanarkshire's ownershipEdit

What the Southern Scotland page said:

After the war the allied nations decided to divide up some of the land that Ur Alba had conquered in the previous two years.
The Celtic Alliance will get the Irish Sea coastline including the towns of Ayr and Dumfries and east to the former A76.

The Kingdom of Northumbria will get a border with the Celtic Alliance along the southern section of the old A76 and also the towns of Lockerbie and Moffat, all land south of the A706 including the towns of Selkirk, Hawick, Melrose, Jedburgh, Kelso, Galashiels, Duns and Eyemouth on the North Sea coast. However in a surprise announcement on the 20th August 2011 the Northumbrian Witain announce that all lands gained after the Ur Alba war will be returned to Southern Scotland on the provision of the election of a democratic government. It will however keep a small section of border with the Celtic Alliance near the town of Gretna.

Under this agreement the border has returned to almost the former English/Scottish border.
The area will be called Southern Scotland, the new nations capital will be in Edinburg.

What the Celtic Alliance page said:

The capital is Glasgow. It is formed from the former Scottish counties of Dumfrieshire, Perthshire, Inverness-shire, Ayrshire, Caithness and Sutherland, Ross, Moray, Angus, Aberdeenshire, Argyll, and small areas of neighbouring counties.
Areas around the towns of Ayr and Dumfries were taken into the Celtic Alliance after the defeat of Ur Alba in the Ur Alba War.

What the Hiatory of Scotland page said:

East Kirkcudbrightshire - Malcolm MacKinnon : Fishermens Guild
West Kirkcudbrightshire - Fiona Fletcher : Oat Guild'

The Celtic Alliance page say it has not got control over Fife. The Celtic Alliance page say it has not got control over Fife, Lanarkshire or Remfrewshire, the Southern Scotland page said they had Lanarkshire partly annexed off them by the Celtic Alliance and most maps show them as CA held. User:Todetode :. ~ Under the Hood, Connect to Basic information? ~ Todetode (talk). 05:07, July 7, 2020 (UTC)

Much of mainland Scotland in generalEdit

The Kingdom of Scotland page said:

In mid 1990 a group of anti-communist Scottish monarchists joined together under a man named James Stuart, their aim was to restore to Kingdom of Scotland to its former heights, James Stuart took the royal name James VIII to try to show continuity with the former Jacobian Kingdom from pre 1707. Over the next three years support for this new Kingdom grew throughout the area until it controlled nearly two-thirds of the former south of Scotland. Throughout this time they struck into the heart of the Scottish Alliance suffering few losses.
After the collapse of the Kingdom of Scotland, King James VIII fled east into the Scottish wilds near the current Northumbria border, nothing has been heard of him since the winter of 2007, he is assumed dead.

What the Celtic Alliance page said:

The capital is Glasgow. It is formed from the former Scottish counties of Dumfrieshire, Perthshire, Invernessshire, Ayrshire, Caithness and Sutherland, Ross, Moray, Angus, Aberdeenshire, Argyll, and small areas of neighbouring counties.
Areas around the towns of Ayr and Dumfries were taken into the Celtic Alliance after the defeat of Ur Alba in the Ur Alba War.

It becomes clear that the three missiles that targeted Glasgow did not all reach their target, with one missile reaching the nuclear base on the river Clyde, the western fringes of the city and towns notably Greenock, Clydebank and Dumbarton receive heavy damage. Nevertheless, the majority of the city remains intact. Contact with Dublin is restored and long supply lines are started via Oban as the lower Clyde is contaminated. Glasgow formally appoints a new Senator Provost (as opposed to OTL Lord Provost) who will sit in the Dublin Parliament. The Senator Provost is Jim Sillers a well known trade unionist and Scottish Nationalist.

What the Southern Scotland page said:

After the war the allied nations decided to divide up some of the land that Ur Alba had conquered in the previous two years.
The Celtic Alliance will get the Irish Sea coastline including the towns of Ayr and Dumfries and east to the former A76.
The Kingdom of Northumbria will get a border with the Celtic Alliance along the southern section of the old A76 and also the towns of Lockerbie and Moffat, all land south of the A706 including the towns of Selkirk, Hawick, Melrose, Jedburgh, Kelso, Galashiels, Duns and Eyemouth on the North Sea coast.
However in a surprise announcement on the 20th August 2011 the Northumbrian Witain announce that all lands gained after the Ur Alba war will be returned to Southern Scotland on the provision of the election of a democratic government. It will however keep a small section of border with the Celtic Alliance near the town of Gretna.
Under this agreement the border has returned to almost the former English/Scottish border.
The area will be called Southern Scotland, the new nations capital will be in Edinburg.

The Ur Alba War page says:

The leaders of the township of Stranraer have sent a message to the Chamberhouse in Peebles.

What the History of Scotland page said:

East Kirkcudbrightshire - Malcolm MacKinnon : Fishermens Guild
West Kirkcudbrightshire - Fiona Fletcher : Oat Guild
  • Basically the maps are at total conflict with the lore and cannon and the CA page dose not list CA controlee ver several places!
  • Angus, Sterlingshire, (give or take Southern Scotland having the Falkirk-Grangemouth area on one map.), Remfrewshire and, Dumbartonshire, Wigtownshire, Clackmannenshire, Kinross-shire, Buteshire, Banfshire and Kincardineshire should all be unclaimed terra nullis, save for the discovered remnants of Greenock, Clydebank and Dumbarton cities.
    • The part of Scotland that is CA on their page (pluss the unclaimed adjoining territory of Buteshire and Banfshire) would have joined in the wake of the SNP singeing the Hebrides up for it. I'm Shure the mayors Ian C. Fraser and Allan G. Sellar would like to join it. The rest, which the CA page puts down as unclaimed could be the Kingdom of Scotland, which they conquer and occupies, but did not fully integrate. The CA wants to set up a new state, but the (anti-English\Irish) racist basterds are even worse to reprogram than Southern Scotland.
    • The Celtic Alliance gets the Ur Alba land between the the Irish Sea coastline including the towns of Ayr and Dumfries and east to the former A76.
    • Fife could also see the part that is not nuked and\or ireradited could set up on their own. A Scottish equivalent of Matlock? The united towns of Kirkcaldy, Cowdenbeath, Glenrothes, Cupar, Tayport and Kelty remain a united group of minor city states and only join the Celtic Alliance reluctantly in 2008? It would add a touch of realism and increase plausibility with out screwing up the time line's cannon or lore.
    • Wigtownshire is just over the sea from N. Ireland and would logically join the CA early on, but soon got captured by Ur Alba.

FifeEdit

Why would the Celtic Alliance bother with southern and Eastern Fife, its nuked to oblivion apart from around Kirkcaldy, Cowdenbeath, Kelty, Glenrothes, Methil,  a strip along the south bank of the River Tay, Tayport and Cupar. I think it should mostly be unclaimed terra nullis until after 2000.

  • The nuked places are:
  1. RAF Pitreavie Castle- 10kt
  2. Anstruther RSG- 20kt
  3. Rosyth Dockyard- 10kt
  4. RAF Leuchars- 10kt
  5. DM Crombie- 10kt
  6. MOD Caledonia- 10kt
  7. Radiation from Lothian hits Burntisland.

Fife could also see the part that is not nuked and\or irradiated could set up on their own. A Scottish equivalent of Matlock? The united towns of Kirkcaldy, Cowdenbeath, Glenrothes, Cupar, Tayport and Kelty remain a united group of minor city states and only join the Celtic Alliance reluctantly in 2008? It would add a touch of realism and increase plausibility with out screwing up the time line's cannon or lore.

WalesEdit

What the Celtic Alliance page said:

The (south Welsh) Valleys, Monmouthshire, Glamorgan, Neath and Bridgend joined in 1999.
Powys joined in 2002.
  • Basically most of the maps are at total conflict with the lore and cannon, they are all been shown as  unclaimed terra nullis!
    • It would make sense for the Celts, either on their own imitative or prompted by the Pembroke based Welsh state, to be annexed the region time outside the few dead zones in Glamorganshire and Gwent.

CA held "dead zones" in the former UKEdit

The area around Holy Loch and Faslaine would be radioactive ruble for centuries to come, as would parts of Glamorgan in Wales

Kingdom of ScotlandEdit

The Kingdom of Scotland page said:

In mid 1990 a group of anti-communist Scottish monarchists joined together under a man named James Stuart, their aim was to restore to Kingdom of Scotland to its former heights, James Stuart took the royal name James VIII to try to show continuity with the former Jacobian Kingdom from pre 1707. Over the next three years support for this new Kingdom grew throughout the area until it controlled nearly two-thirds of the former south of Scotland. Throughout this time they struck into the heart of the Scottish Alliance suffering few losses.
After the collapse of the Kingdom of Scotland, King James VIII fled east into the Scottish wilds near the current Northumbria border, nothing has been heard of him since the winter of 2007, he is assumed dead.
  • The Kingdom of Scotland was never fully defined and was thus remains vague and unfilled.
    • The part of Scotland that is CA on their page (plus the unclaimed adjoining territory of Buteshire, Kincardine and Banffshire) would have joined in the wake of the SNP singeing the Hebrides up for it. I'm Shure the mayors Ian C. Fraser and Allan G. Sellar would like to join it. The rest, which the CA page puts down as unclaimed could be the Kingdom of Scotland, which they conquer and occupies, but did not fully integrate. The CA wants to set up a new state, but the (anti-English\Irish) racist bastards are even worse to reprogram than Southern Scotland.
    • The Celtic Alliance gets the Ur Alba land between the the Irish Sea coastline including the towns of Ayr and Dumfries and east to the former A76.
    • Fife could also see the part that is not nuked and\or irradiated could set up on their own. A Scottish equivalent of Matlock? The united towns of Kirkcaldy, Cowdenbeath, Glenrothes, Cupar, Tayport and Kelty remain a united group of minor city states and only join the Celtic Alliance reluctantly in 2008? It would add a touch of realism and increase plausibility with out screwing up the time line's cannon or lore.
    • Wigtownshire is just over the sea from N. Ireland and would logically join the CA early on, but soon got captured by Ur Alba.

SummeryEdit

These facets are mentioned on only a few pages other than their home pages and can be tactfully modified and\or removed with out any causing chaos in the timeline if one is willing to spend a bit of time fact checking afterwards. User:Todetode :. ~ Under the Hood, Connect to Basic information? ~ Todetode (talk). 11:30, July 4, 2020 (UTC)

ResultEdit

No one cared or even bothered to notice, except for one who resented I was even contributing in the first place, so I gave up. I had 5 other article planned, but they will only appear here as their draft form and never go to Althistory Wiki.User:Todetode :. ~ Under the Hood, Connect to Basic information? ~ Todetode (talk). 20:57, July 15, 2020 (UTC)

Claimed acts of poor story telling, research and time line work.Edit

VWM240mmAtomicAnnie01

The Atomic Annie nuclear artillery peace.


Plot defectsEdit

  • The Celtic Alliance- The 5 surviving SNP members would set up a pro-Irish regime in the Scottish Highlands and Islands, not join with Ireland. This is because the SNP is, well, Scottish nationalist!
  • The CA is acknowledged to be an 'Ierland wank', but was never corrected, improved or sufficiently explained away even at the start. It is held up as an example of excellence despite being discredited as a 'wank article'!
  • A Welsh nationalist regime would have probably occurred in North Wales (Conway district, Powys, Denbighshire and Merionethshire.).
  • A local regime would probably have occurred in the Shrewsbury\Oswestry\Ludlow region.
  • Mongolia would become a Siberian client state, not a Siberian colony.

UK nuking errorsEdit

If DD83's lore and Cold War strategy are right Luton, Dundee and Aberdeen are dead; but if article cannon is right they were not hit.

A suggested compromise= Glasgow and Liverpool were slightly missed all ready. The 200kt Luton nuke missed by 10 miles and hit Barton-le-Clay, while the other 2 100kt nukes exploder 5 miles east out to sea. The 10kt weapons aimed at the harbours and Luton Airport will hit as planned. They will be damaged an irradiated, but not totally ruined.

  • Dundee and Aberdeen were not nuked cannon, but deserved it under DD83 lore.
  • Luton was hit with a 200kt nuked and was never nuked at the same time, the latter being neither or lore!
  • New London (Windsor) is near to Slough and the 100kt that hit it would have devastate Windsor as well. It 'survived', like Luton did.

ASB national activityEdit

  • Soviet Siberia is growing too fast.
  • It is way too optimistic in Sub-Saran Africa, Poland, Cuba, DPRK and S. Korea.
  • It is too pessimistic in the PRC and the former Yugoslavia.

Errors with the PODEdit

  • The DPRK, S. Korea, FRG, GDR, Poland and Cuba would be wiped out pile of radioactive slag.
  • RAF Bircham Newton was not hit.
  • Željava Air Base was not hit until it was filled in circa early 2011 dut to it being nuked localy on the Yugoslav, Bosnian and Croat pages.
  • Western Europe was hit too hard, by the nukes. Outside of central Europe the Soviets' plans for Europe were to destroy military and industrial stuff, since they wanted to conquer, enslave and plunder (see the real life in the GDR). The USA was the only nation who went mostly after eastern European civvies in cities. the British, French, China, S. Africa and the Israelis only wanted to do what was necessary to stay alive. Russia, India, Pakistan and N. Korea have no set plan, just a general policy that is probably mostly anti-military.
  • Slovakia would be devastated, but not a wiped out pile of radioactive slag.
  • San Julián Air Base and San Antonio de los Baños Airfield were not hit, but Havana and San Diego were.
  • The American base at Aarbourg would be be targeted, not Copenhagen.
  • A sea strike at Inishtrahull would happen off the Donegal coast, since UK subs reguly loitered their.
  • The Soviets oddly did not hit RAAF Bace Woomera, Laverton radar station or Jervis Bay's navy base. Somehow 3 major Australian cities were targeted instead: Perth-Fremantle 300 to 400kt, Melbourne 500kt and Sydney 500kt.

Strategic errorsEdit

  • Several parts of Western Europe was hit too hard, by the nukes. Outside of central Europe the Soviets' plans for Europe were to destroy military and industrial stuff, since they reportedly wanted to conquer, enslave and plunder the UK, France and Belgian (see the real life Soviet occupation GDR).
  • The USA was reportedly the only nation who went mostly after eastern European civvies in cities. the British, the French, China, S. Africa and the Israelis only wanted to do what was necessary to stay alive. Russia, India, Pakistan and N. Korea have no set plan, just a general policy that is probably mostly anti-military.

Long term planning errorsEdit

With out Western aid most if not all of Sub-Saharan Africa outside of the control of S. Africa soon would collapse into anarchy, famine and pestilence. The only major crisis in DD1983 Africa is tyrents.

Nations going shitwardsEdit

UK nations going shitwards in 2011-2012Edit

  1. Jnjaycpa founded South Wales and it was rejected as unviable‎ The River Nile-2 messed with South Wales. NewWessex Founded the Wesh Republic.
  2. Arstarpool Founded Cornwall and Owen1983 tried to set up a bigger Cornish nation which was unvadme. 82.11.101.159 and ‎Ripping my lips off for you messed with it, DeviouslyDeviant rebooted Cornwall.
  3. Owen1983 created Shropshire. Smoggy 80 had already claimed Shropshire for the CA. Owen1983 was offered Staffordshire, Worcestershire and Herefordshire instead by Smoggy 80. Mumby expanded into Mercia and The River Nile-2 messed about with it.
  4. Mumby founded Southern Scotland and Smoggy 80 expanded it as well as kicking them out of Lokabie.
  5. Emporerjames founded The partly unviable Republic of the Trent and Derwent Valleys and The River Nile-2 messed with it.
  6. Whipsnade added a city state based on Kibworth and Imperium Guy added a nearby Gypsy state. Both were dodgy on viability and met a tide of  bias scorn, ridicule and derision. Both users then had them deleted. Years later an unsuspecting Nay Mate Woody and BroccotropolisGov founded Leicestershire. MrWoodward expanded it. It was allowed, but only on condition that that it would dissolve after about a year and become part of Newolland.

User:Todetode :. ~ Under the Hood, Connect to Basic information? ~ Todetode (talk). 21:46, July 20, 2020 (UTC)

Chinese nations going shitwards in 2010-2014Edit

Arstarpool founded Imperial China. Scandinor, Yankovic270 and Kunarin loved it, no one else wanted it, it was a legitimate concept, so they conspired to write it out of history with the Siberian annexing it in 2014. User:Todetode :. ~ Under the Hood, Connect to Basic information? ~ Todetode (talk). 21:46, July 20, 2020 (UTC)

A possible more likely scenarioEdit

DavyCrockettBomb

Photograph of a U.S. developed M-388 Davy Crockett nuclear weapon mounted to a recoilless rifle on a tripod, shown here (1961) at the Aberdeen Proving Ground in Maryland in March 1961. It used the smallest nuclear warhead ever developed by the United States.

  1. The Cuban Missile Crisis.
  2. The 1979 Soviet invasion of Afghanistan.

The rival variantEdit

1962: The Apocalypse is meant to be implausible and more like a semi-realistic "what if" movie like, but even they realised Cuba and both Koreas were doomed!

Link to outside TLsEdit

Also seeEdit

  1. Todetode's sandbox- sutff for Athistory fandom pages (1983: Doomsday)- draft copy of a page for the Althistory wiki
  2. https://1991-new-world-order.fandom.com/wiki/Errors_I_think_hit_DD83_on_Althistory_Wiki
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